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Bullish (BLSH.US) 2025年第三季度业绩电话会
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会议摘要
A crypto platform showcases its strategic expansion in liquidity services, stablecoin partnerships, and tokenization, emphasizing institutional client focus and regulatory approvals. The platform highlights successful launches, such as options trading, and anticipates growth in tokenization, bolstered by ongoing license acquisitions and market opportunities.
会议速览
Bullish Global Q3 2035 Earnings Call Highlights and Forward-Looking Statements
Operator introduces earnings call, CFO discusses forward-looking statements and risks, mentions non-IFRS measures, and refers to SEC filings for more details.
Bullish's Q3 2025 Record Earnings and Strategic Positioning in Crypto Trends
Bullish reports record earnings in Q3 2025, with strong momentum in options trading, US exchange, liquidity services, and index businesses. The company emphasizes its strategic positioning at the intersection of regulatory clarity, institutional adoption, and tokenization trends, particularly in the tokenization of traditional assets, which it views as transformative for the next decade. Bullish highlights its role in facilitating the tokenization of the US dollar through stablecoins and its comprehensive liquidity services platform.
Expanding Tokenization and Liquidity Services: A Journey into Future Asset Class Growth
A company focuses on enhancing tokenization and liquidity services, expanding blockchain partnerships, and successfully launching crypto options trading, anticipating significant market growth and share in the evolving digital asset landscape.
Bullish's Global Expansion and Diversification in Crypto Markets
Bullish highlights steady global progress, integrating major brokerages and crypto funds, excelling in information services, and expanding media market share. The company underscores its commitment to tokenization and infrastructure shifts, positioning for sustained growth with strategic licenses, technology, and talent.
Q3 Financial Highlights and Q4 Growth Projections for Bullish
Bullish reports robust Q3 revenue growth, with adjusted revenue up 72% YoY. S-SNOM revenue surges, driving 53% of total revenue YTD. Anticipates Q4 revenue increase due to higher volatility and active trading customers, with adjusted operating expenses and EBITDA growth projected.
Liquidity Services Growth: Stablecoins vs Non-Stablecoins and ICO Platform Competition
The dialogue discusses the expansion of liquidity services, highlighting growth in stablecoin issuers and the emerging market for non-stablecoin projects. It addresses the economics of serving these different types of tokens and the competitive landscape with ICO platforms, emphasizing the focus on high-quality crypto projects for institutional clients.
Exploring Competitive Landscape and Performance Metrics in Transfer Agent Capabilities
The dialogue explores the strategic motivations behind acquiring transfer agent capabilities, considering the competitive setup in the market for commodity-type RWAs and single stocks. It also delves into the performance of assets under management during recent volatility, highlighting healthy spreads and other useful operating metrics.
Tokenization of the US Dollar: A Comprehensive Approach to Blockchain Commerce
The dialogue explores the process of tokenizing the US dollar for blockchain commerce, highlighting the spectrum of services involved, from smart contract creation to compliance licensing. It emphasizes the importance of listing tokens on regulated exchanges, ensuring liquidity, and leveraging premier crypto properties for visibility. The focus is on providing a respected and accessible platform for asset issuers.
Exploring Tokenization, Transfer Agent Licenses, and Exchange Resilience in the Evolving Financial Landscape
Discusses the strategic importance of tokenizing US securities, the role of transfer agent licenses in facilitating robust listings and liquidity, and highlights the resilience of exchange technology during market volatility, emphasizing preparedness and adaptability in the face of regulatory and technological advancements.
Perils of Unregulated Perpetual Futures Markets for Institutions
A deep dive reveals the unfair liquidation practices in unregulated perpetual futures markets, discouraging real institutions from participating due to risks of losing fully collateralized gains.
Analyzing Subscription Services Revenue Growth Amid Seasonal and Market Fluctuations
Discussed factors influencing Q4 subscription services revenue, including event seasonality, digital asset price movements, and new contract timing. Highlighted long-term growth potential and pipeline expansion despite short-term challenges.
Expanding Onboarding Pipeline and Challenges in Customer Acquisition
Discusses the rapid growth of the onboarding pipeline with notable early wins, but highlights challenges in the rigorous due diligence process, especially concerning foreign exchange risks, impacting the pace of customer acquisition.
Anticipated Impact of Clarity Act on Crypto Liquidity Services and Market Structure
Optimism surrounds the potential passage of the Clarity Act, expected to streamline crypto operations across states, benefiting infrastructure providers. The speaker highlights the importance of bipartisan support and the forthcoming negotiation processes involving both the Senate and the House to finalize a bill conducive to industry growth. Active engagement in upcoming meetings with senators underscores the significance of this legislation for the crypto business and institutional participation.
Strategic Regulatory Approvals Accelerate US Crypto Exchange Launch and Adoption
By securing stringent global regulatory approvals, including New York's BitLicense, the company enabled swift US market entry and rapid adoption, offering a unified global order book that distinguishes its service.
US Market Growth & Trading Volume Momentum
Discussion highlights the significant contribution of new customer momentum to trading volumes in the US, emphasizing the organic growth potential and the impact of options trading. The dialogue underscores the company's diversified revenue streams, high incremental margins on trading, and strategic focus on institutions, liquidity services, and stablecoin trading, with a forecast for continued growth and improved margins in 2026.
Analysis of Options and Perpetual Futures Spread Metrics Amidst Volatility
Discussion focused on the monthly metrics of options and perpetual futures, highlighting the impact of volatility on spreads. The conversation revealed strategies for optimizing pricing across products to enhance total adjusted transaction revenue. Negative spreads in perpetual futures were attributed to heightened volatility, with an optimistic outlook for future improvements.
Capital Efficiency and Collateral Management: Advantages of Unified Margining and Tokenized Assets
The dialogue highlights the benefits of a unified matching engine and global order book for capital efficiency, enabling smart margining and portfolio margining for options trading. It also explores opportunities in expanding tokenized asset partnerships and the potential for revenue positivity through options trading.
New Margining System Approval & Tokenization Opportunities in Gold Industry
The approval of a new Var based margining system at a gold company marks a significant step towards efficiency and opens up new opportunities through tokenization. The company anticipates growth in transaction revenues, with 2026 expected to surpass 2025. Monthly exchange data provides real-time insights into progress.
Optimizing Pricing Strategies Amid Market Volatility
The dialogue centers around refining pricing structures to enhance total adjusted transaction revenue, emphasizing adaptability to market dynamics and customer base shifts. The discussion highlights the impact of low volatility on spreads, ongoing optimization efforts, and the balance between spread width and volume to achieve revenue goals. Future adjustments will continue to be made to optimize for total adjusted transaction revenue, acknowledging the dynamic nature of the market.
Expanding Crypto Licenses: Focus on UK Legislation and Incremental Global Markets
The company has secured key licenses in Asia, Europe, and the US, planning to focus on the UK's upcoming crypto trading legislation. Incremental spot licenses will be pursued, with ongoing efforts to consolidate existing markets into a global order book, including derivatives and index businesses.
Conference Call Concludes with Apologies and Future Engagement Promises
The speaker apologizes for the length of the call, promising individual discussions and updates on accomplishments in the coming months, thanking participants for their engagement.
要点回答
Q:What major business launches and partnerships did Bullish achieve in the last six weeks?
A:Bullish fully launched its Options franchise with encouraging early results, launched its US exchange business, and onboarded many new liquidity services customers, including high-profile crypto projects. It also experienced growth in its media business, ranking as the top crypto news site globally by views.
Q:How does Bullish view the process of tokenization and its potential?
A:Bullish views tokenization as the most transformational crypto value proposition of the next decade, and it is positioned to be leaders in this space through its liquidity services platform. The process involves turning traditional financial assets into crypto assets and is expected to continue scaling as more asset classes are tokenized on-chain in the future.
Q:What is the significance of stablecoins and Bullish's role in the ecosystem?
A:Stablecoins represent the tokenization of the US dollar and other traditional assets, and Bullish plays a significant role in the ecosystem by providing services such as smart contract bridging, liquidity, and market visibility for these tokens. Bullish's Liquidity Services platform has become its fastest-growing business, with direct mint-burn capabilities and advanced API orchestration tools.
Q:How is Bullish's Liquidity Services platform performing and what are its plans for future growth?
A:Bullish's Liquidity Services platform is performing well, adding new and diversified customers and expanding its blockchain relationships. The momentum has continued into the third quarter, with a record number of liquidity services partners added. Plans for future growth include expanding into new asset classes, developing asset-specific capabilities, and seeking regulatory approval as a transfer agent for US securities.
Q:How is Bullish expanding internationally and in the US?
A:Bullish is expanding internationally by adding large retail brokerages in Europe, the Middle East, and Latin America and integrating crypto-focused hedge funds and asset managers. In the US, Bullish has onboarded new customers, including retail brokers and institutional clients, and has a liquid global order book that helped in launching without any cold start liquidity problems. Bullish is encouraged by its early progress in the US and looks forward to seizing market share.
Q:What progress has been made in Bullish's information services and media business?
A:Bullish's information services have seen a successful partnership with newly launched exchange-traded crypto products and global ETPs, winning six new benchmark switches and having two active ETP filings. The media business has also grown, capturing more market share against competitors with accessible and high-quality research and analysis provided by Coinbase Research, which also serves as a upsell to Liquidity Services clients.
Q:What are the recent achievements of Bullish and what is their view on the future?
A:Bullish has continued to win and execute on the vision laid out by Dave and Tom upon joining the company. They are proud of their success to date and believe that they are just getting started due to the early stages of tokenization of securities and real-world assets, the shift of financial market infrastructure, and the company's strong position with the right mix of licenses, technology, talent, and experience.
Q:What were the financial highlights of Bullish's third quarter?
A:For the third quarter, Bullish reported total adjusted revenue of 76.5 million, up 34% sequentially and 72% year over year, exceeding the high end of their guidance. Liquidity services and all-branded products reached $49.8 billion, up over 50% from the second quarter and over 300% from the prior year's quarter. Adjusted operating expenses were $47.9 million, down 2% from the second quarter, and adjusted EBITDA was $28.6 million, up 253% sequentially and 271% year over year. Adjusted net income was $13.8 million.
Q:How has Bullish's market approach to liquidity services evolved, and what is the competitive landscape like?
A:Bullish has seen growth in the number of stablecoin customers and is not just focused on stablecoins but also layer 1 blockchains and crypto project issuers. They have partnered with most stablecoins except for USDT and see opportunities to monetize stablecoins and non-stablecoins through various revenue-generating activities. The competitive landscape involves partnerships with high-quality crypto platforms and a focus on institutional customers with a minimum market cap of at least half a billion dollars.
Q:What are the prospects for stablecoin and non-stablecoin liquidity services?
A:Bullish continues to add stablecoin customers and sees a need for its liquidity services among stablecoin issuers, layer 1 blockchains, and crypto project issuers. They are seeing more of a blend among their client base. With the recent regulatory changes like the Genius Act, there is potential for growth in stablecoin issuers. The company is focusing on high-quality crypto platforms that target institutional clients and is excited about both stable and non-stable coin opportunities.
Q:Why is it important for Bullish to seek transfer agent capabilities and licensing?
A:Bullish is seeking transfer agent capabilities and licensing to potentially offer services related to coin indices and bespoke products. This would enable the company to cater to a broader set of institutional clients and add value through expertise in the tokenization of assets.
Q:How has Bullish performed during recent heightened volatility?
A:Bullish has performed well during recent heightened volatility, with the spread on their AM product looking pretty healthy. In addition to this, the company is considering other operating metrics that may be useful to assess performance during such periods, though specifics were not provided in the transcript.
Q:What is the strategy for the crypto news site mentioned?
A:The strategy for the crypto news site involves owning premier properties in crypto for visibility, helping important institutional people and companies gather at key events, and using API orchestration, direct mint earn, and writing smart contracts to facilitate bridging from layer 1 to layer 1.
Q:How does the speaker's company plan to help customers with the transition to tokenization?
A:The company plans to assist customers by being helpful in the tokenization process, offering a range of services including API orchestration, direct mint earn, and the writing of smart contracts for bridging from layer 1 to layer 1.
Q:What is the perceived future of tokenization according to the speaker?
A:The speaker believes that tokenization is huge and that there has been a significant shift in perception, with major banks preparing for the wave of tokenization. The benefits of tokenization, such as using tokens as collateral, are now widely recognized.
Q:What was the speaker's company's performance during the flash crash on October 10?
A:During the flash crash on October 10, the speaker's company was proud of its performance and technology resilience, which preserved more liquidity on its order books compared to other venues, resulting in fewer price wicks and liquidations.
Q:What was the reaction of a prominent executive from a trading firm to the speaker's company's clearing and derivatives processes?
A:A prominent executive from a trading firm was appalled by the 'heads I win, tails you lose' approach of unregulated perpetual futures markets and decided that the speaker's company would not emulate those practices.
Q:What does the company's guidance for the fourth quarter imply about the business's performance?
A:The guidance for the fourth quarter is flat to modest growth, which the company attributes to seasonality, the absence of events revenue, and a timing element due to the signing of new contracts towards the end of the quarter.
Q:How does the company anticipate the growth in subscription services and revenue from tokenization?
A:The company remains very confident in the growth outlook for subscription services and other revenue. They see tokenization as a potential large tailwind, supported by broad-based growth across all line items and new customer wins.
Q:What challenges have been faced with onboarding new customers and what steps are being taken to address them?
A:Onboarding new customers has proven to be challenging, with a robust diligence process similar to that of FTX to avoid any risks. However, early wins have been made, the pipeline is quickly filling up with notable names, and there are positive surprises with the number of big customers already onboard.
Q:What is the speaker's level of optimism regarding the passing of the crypto bill and what are the potential benefits of its passage?
A:The speaker is very optimistic that the crypto bill will pass due to bipartisan support. They believe that its passage will be beneficial for the PTO industry by eliminating the need to obtain specific state-by-state approvals for operating in the crypto business, which will be a boost for infrastructure providers and help attract more institutions and tokenization participants.
Q:How has the U.S. business momentum been faster than expected and what decisions contributed to this?
A:The U.S. business momentum has been faster than expected, which the speaker attributes to faithful decisions made over the last couple of years. One significant decision was to seek the toughest regulatory approvals globally for spot crypto trading. This involved not just obtaining licenses but also asserting the ability to operate a single global order book, which required extensive engagement with regulators and took significantly longer than a 'short-cut' approach taken by other exchanges. Despite the delay, this strategy has led to quicker business entry and significant trading volume growth once licensed.
Q:Why did the speaker's company decide to obtain the toughest regulatory approvals for spot crypto trading?
A:The speaker's company made the decision to obtain the toughest regulatory approvals for spot crypto trading as an exchange to ensure a robust and trustworthy platform. They aimed to meet regulatory standards not only in the United States but also internationally, including Hong Kong, Germany, and the United Kingdom. This decision, although challenging and time-consuming, has allowed their company to offer a unique service with a global order book, which has positively affected their trading volume and customer onboarding speed.
Q:What factors are contributing to the increased trading volume and how is it expected to grow?
A:The increased trading volume is attributed to a combination of factors including more customers, price volatility, and internal pricing changes. The speaker notes that they are achieving higher trading revenues per unit of volatility. Additionally, the U.S. is becoming a major contributor to growth, with the launch of options being a significant factor in transaction revenues. Cross sales, liquidity services, trading in various stablecoins, and a focus on institutional客户需求 are driving the momentum. The early success of options is revealing a strong market need for an options exchange that allows for trading across different financial instruments on a compliant platform, suggesting further growth.
Q:How do the speaker's company's incremental margins compare between the trading and SSO sides?
A:The speaker notes that incremental margins are higher on the trading side than on the SSO (Subscription, Support, and Other) side. They mention that third-quarter incremental margins were above 100% due to increased advertising spend in the second quarter for an event. Looking forward, they expect to demonstrate operating leverage, with transaction revenues contributing to higher margins. They also project a volatile environment in 2026, which could continue to drive higher margins and earnings.
Q:What potential benefits do options bring in terms of capital efficiencies and cost margining?
A:The potential benefits of options in terms of capital efficiencies and cost margining include the ability to offer greater cost margining capabilities. By having a single global order book and matching engine, customers can place all their derivatives and spot transactions in a single account, which allows for smart and sensible margining. Portfolio margining is offered, which provides a reasonable margin based on the customer's holdings, which is beneficial for the options trading community.
Q:What is the significance of portfolio margining for options trading?
A:Portfolio margining is significant for options trading as it allows for the offset of margins based on the correlation between a customer's holdings. This means that if a customer owns a highly correlated crypto asset and has sold short another highly correlated crypto asset, some margin offset can be provided, leading to more efficient use of capital.
Q:What complex systems have been implemented for managing risk and how do they contribute to the company's success?
A:The company has implemented a complex system involving a new Var based margining system and a single matching engine for multiple asset classes, which has contributed to the early success and will become more efficient over time. This allows for a more efficient aggregation of trades and positions into a single global account, providing cross-liquidity services and exchange collateral opportunities. The passage of the market infrastructure bill could also lead to new opportunities arising from tokenization.
Q:What is the company's outlook on future transaction revenue performance?
A:The company does not provide specific guidance on future transaction revenues but continues to see progress in the line item. They expect 2026 to be a better year than 2025, which was better than 2024, and invite investors to watch the monthly metrics for updates on all transaction revenue line items.
Q:What factors contributed to the change in spot spreads in Q2, and how does the company plan to manage them in the future?
A:The factors that contributed to the change in spot spreads in Q2 include the company's pricing structure iteration and a low-volatility environment. Spreads rebounded strongly from the lows seen in May and June. The company plans to continue optimizing for total adjusted transaction revenue per unit volatility, adjusting spreads based on market, customer base, and volatility changes. They aim for higher spreads to lead to more volume when it offsets the costs, maintaining a reasonable baseline for the future while acknowledging the dynamic nature of the market.
Q:What is the company's strategy regarding geographical expansion and licensing?
A:The company has secured a bit license and expanded its operations in the US. As for future plans, the UK still lacks legislation around crypto trading, but the company has already secured a presence in Asia and Europe. The focus will be on obtaining incremental spot licenses in various geographies, but it is not expected to discuss non-significant items like the UK on the call. The company will continue to gather and share licenses for spot, derivatives, and index business. The big geographical markets have been covered, and the company's focus will be on ongoing license acquisition and management.
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